No One Follows the Bible

jerryscattom1990 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - or in your case, mayhap your friends cousin inspired a cancer research program. i dont know, but there is always a glint of light, even in blackness

jerryscattom1990 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - do you want to move to messages? i hate having to write 10 different comments... (this is to martini - someone who can articulate a thought.)

Sauls2286 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - Death is a result of sin...as I said before. The evil and the righteous are subject to the laws of nature. Since Adam's sin, people die. All people..."it is appointed unto man once to die." My brother in law died due to a drowning accident this past summer. Was that God's plan? I don't really think so - he was in water over his head and couldn't overcome the waves. If I ride my bike down the interstate and get killed, was that God's plan? Uh uh. I was stupid and foolish...and died.

AernoutMJC Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - You, dear Sir, make assumptions and jump to conclusions. First of all, you don't know anything about me so you'd better keep your remarks about research and following scientists to yourself. Secondly, I didn't say anything about the age of the earth or the universe, so what does that have to do with my remark? Your remark, however, shows a clear and remarkably common misunderstanding of the theory of evolution. But please, go ahead and feel superior. Just don't bother me. Conversation over.

martinimix79 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - You asked me to provide proof of my accusations on contradictions in the bible and you respond with this crap? The topic for contradiction is MURDER. Your 10 Commandments says NOT TO MURDER. Yet, in your same scriptures, it was okay to kill off entire nations, entire families, entire groups of men, women and children.

martinimix79 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - On top of that, your god is omniscient. So how would your god not know that you're going to bike down the highway and get killed? Are you saying your god is NOT omniscient? That your god is not all-knowing? If your god is not all-knowing, why call it god? Remember: your god apparently knows what will happen in every moment of every day, for all of eternity. If it is not your god's plan that you're going to do something stupid tomorrow, then your god is simply NOT all-knowing.

martinimix79 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - I rather keep it more public, so everyone can be exposed to our debate, but in this case, I have sent you an email instead. I will make our debate known publicly in a public journal later.

Sauls2286 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - God knows everything...he is God...he is omniscient. What does that have to do with me riding down the road and getting killed? Just because he knows what is going to happen doesn't mean he has pre-scripted everything out! Your conclusion "If it is not your god's plan that you're going to do something stupid tomorrow, then your god is simply NOT all-knowing." is not even logical.

Sauls2286 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - I haven't responded with any "crap." I will respond to your Scripture references...I haven't look them up yet. Be patient :)

martinimix79 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - "Your conclusion "If it is not your god's plan that you're going to do something stupid tomorrow, then your god is simply NOT all-knowing." is not even logical." Pretend you are omniscient. Day 1 @ 3:10pm, you KNOW that Kevin is going to fall into a hole. Day 2 @ 5:09pm, you KNOW that Kevin is going to have a bomb explode in his car. Day 3 @ 10:22pm, you KNOW Kevin's mom is going to kill herself.

martinimix79 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - ALL-KNOWING simply means that you are able to know EVERYTHING. A god is called a "god" because it has the infinite power (omnipotence) to influence everything it knows. Since your god KNOWS what happens every moment of every day for eternity, IT KNOWS that your life is linear. Your life WILL happen the way it's supposed to happen. You cannot change what will happen, because it was already foreseen. As a human, you cannot have hindsight until it happens. As a god, it constantly has 'hindsight'.

martinimix79 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - Since your god already knows what will happen to you, that in itself contradicts that your god 'hopes' that you may choose to a different path. Being omniscient means you KNOW that EVERYTHING will happen as you foresee it. Since everything will happen the way your god foresees it, that in itself contradicts that humans have a choice. You can't change what you think you can, when your god already knows what choices you will make.

martinimix79 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - A 'god' that 'hopes' you will change or choose a different path, is not an all-knowing being. You can't have foresight in the same formula as choice. You cannot have a being that KNOWS you will fall into a hole tomorrow at 5pm, hope that you will choose a different path that will avoid falling into that hole. It is redundant to HOPE and KNOW FOR SURE at the same time. IT SIMPLY contradicts itself.

parfumeria33ro Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - WTF are you talking about, people? God Who? :)) Before the so called Jesus, there were as many Gods as family households. The Romans, Greeks and Egiptians had numerous Gods that had NOTHING to do with today's God and Jesus. Here's the FUN PART: TODAY, as we speak, way over 80% of the Earth's population doesn't give a shit about Europe's or America's God. Think... China, India and others. They're Buddha's people. Middle East? Allah. They're going to hell, right? No! 'Cause there's NO God :))

Sauls2286 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - Let's go back further than ancient China: where did the first humans get an idea of right and wrong? You can make all kinds of theories, but the reality is that right and wrong come from somewhere...or someone.

Sauls2286 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - No it doesn't contradict itself. We are dealing with GOD. It is true - understanding this is a very difficult thing - because we are NOT God. Being FINITE, we cannot fully comprehend an INFINITE being. If we could understand God, we would be better than God. That being said, God is omniscient he has given us free will...he can create any reality or parameters that he wishes! I'll try to respond to more of your questions when we don't have a house full of people chaos. :)

martinimix79 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - /sigh You simply and utterly just don't get it. IT DOES NOT MATTER WHETHER your god is infinite or not. What you again and again just don't understand is that as if an all-knowing being ALREADY KNOWS what will happen, in all moments of time, it means that ALL THINGS that WILL HAPPEN IS GOING TO HAPPEN. IT MEANS that to this all-knowing being, IT HAS ALREADY HAPPENED. You think you have free will because you LACK hindsight, but free will contradicts omnipotence. Period.

martinimix79 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - /sighing further In short, if you can't see such a simple, SIMPLE concept, there is no point in trying to reason and debate with your further. As I've time and again exclaimed, "There is no reasoning with those that run on the hamster wheel of redundant circular logic." You Saul, is that hamster.

Sauls2286 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - If I are the Hamster (haha) ,then let this hamster ask you a question: Do you in anyway have an open mind to the possibility to the fact that there is a God - a Universal Being who Created and who is Eternal?

martinimix79 Says:

Nov 25, 2009 - I simply and only debate against religion and the biased religious perspective of what a god, gods, goddesses, the higher power, nirvana, the universe is. I am a spiritual person with a personal relationship with the universe. That is all. There are no laws that bind me, no curses that hold me to live an imprisoned life, nor the contradictory immoralities of scripture.

Domzdream Says:

Nov 26, 2009 - What makes it personal. As in, what do you do with the universe to make it personal and to justify a label of a relationship?

Domzdream Says:

Nov 26, 2009 - Pff...Free will? Where. WHere was our free will where we were apparently born into sin? A sin is something that we do freely and knowingly that what we're doing is wrong, thus it is a sin. So there's the first contradiction in logic- sorry you didn't pick that up by now. Let's be honest. How's that a free will? If I held a gun to your head and told you to love me or else I'll blow your brains out- will you do it? No. Of course not. You'll do it out of fear. But that's not love, man. ...

Domzdream Says:

Nov 26, 2009 - ... Christianity has no morality, it has obediance to authority. That's all. So you're forced into loving and worshipping shomething... or else you burrrrnnnn in the pits of helll. Come on. Besides this being illogical thinking, it is at best, pueril and childish. You do realise your religin originates from Egyptian gods, don't you. Or more to the point, from Egyptian astrology.

butheadVSbevus Says:

Nov 26, 2009 - how long will America be chained down by hypocritical bible thumpers ? I say it's time to rise above. The Turk is right the bible is not followed by the christian right it's a tool to control people and I will not be controlled by a false god.

martinimix79 Says:

Nov 26, 2009 - There is nothing I need to do with the universe. It's like, "what's my relationship with my mom?" or "what's my relationship with my mind?" What makes it 'spiritual' is not something words can describe. Since there are no scriptures, no laws, no hypocrisy, no gods, no any label, it's just as it is. This subject is better suited over tea and dumplings, through philosophy, rather than a thread debating about gods and religion.